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2 quick random points

a) I am very leery of Voter ID laws that may be the cause of further discouraging those who are poor or marginalized from coming out to exercise their democratic right to vote. I believe the current system we had in place was perfectly adequate, and I’ve seen no evidence of widespread voting fraud that Bill C-31 purported to address. This type of a voting fraud bill is what the Republicans have been trying to do for years in federal and state elections in the US in order to disenfranchise those groups that would be most affected by these requirements and thus not be able to come out to vote – a high majority of these groups not coincidentally skew Democratic in their voting patterns. Democrats call this “voter suppression”, and I fear of that happening here.

b) Pursuant to that, I hadn’t heard ANY rumours prior to a couple of days ago that Olivia Chow’s victory in the last election in her riding was anything but legitimate. If “some” people have evidence of that, then bring it forward. Otherwise, rumour-mongering should stop. It doesn’t look very good on the people who are whispering it, nor on the Party they represent.

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12 comments to 2 quick random points

  • Bailey

    [quote comment=”2807″][quote comment=”2796″]Why do you fear that Bill C-31 will lead to voter suppression?

    What’s wrong with showing ID when you vote other than the voters card?

    Why would someone who is eligible to vote not have some sort of ID, a drivers license or a passport or even a photo health card?[/quote]

    Tell you why Bailey.

    I don’t drive and haven’t for close to 20 years – no drivers license.

    Don’t plan to travel and haven’t planned to since 9/11 – no passport.

    BC does not issue photo health cards.

    I have gov’t issued Quebec birth certificate – no picture and it’s in French only. My experience include not having gov’t issued birth certificate accepted as valid in Alberta and BC.

    Government demands for ‘high-security measures’ such as RDIF chips and requirements of photo ID are intrusive. I value my privacy and prefer to keep it that way. I also value my freedom. That freedom becomes less so with governments (and corporations) creating new ways to tack what I do, where I go etc… The less they stick their noses into my life (or yours or anyone’s) the better. (and I was way further off ‘the grid’ 20 years ago than I am now).

    What’s the next step? requirement that we all carry our ‘papers’ with us at all times? failure to do so resulting in what exactly?

    I don’t like the slope this is edging towards.

    I’ll turn the question back on you.

    What purpose does MORE identification really serve? And WHO does it serve?

    And I really wish someone could provide solid evidence of the ‘rationale’ behind all this C-31 claptrap in the first place. Where is the proof of ‘voter fraud’ and no, I don’t mean Cherniak’s ‘rumours’.[/quote]

    You never answered the first part about why it would lead to voter supression or even what’s wrong with the idea of showing ID to vote.

    I’m not for or against the bill. I’m indifferent. I don’t think there is any grand scheme of suppressing voters or big brother-esque conspiracy ideas fo the government spying on me. I don’t see how it’s that any more difficult to bring a photo ID to vote when you have to bring that voters card to begin with.

    I need a photo ID for many things in life, to set up a bank account, to get a credit card, to buy alcohol if I look young enough, to travel to another country, to get a gym membership they used my drivers license to take my address, to get a movie membership as well. To show a photo ID to vote doesn’t seem out of the ordinary to me.

    I can easily go against the idea if someone is willing to show me that it will lead to voter supression or will cause problems but with some evidence/stats/studies whatever but I just think that showing ID when voting isn’t going to turn someone away from voting. Call me crazy if that’s the case.

  • [quote comment=”2796″]Why do you fear that Bill C-31 will lead to voter suppression?

    What’s wrong with showing ID when you vote other than the voters card?

    Why would someone who is eligible to vote not have some sort of ID, a drivers license or a passport or even a photo health card?[/quote]

    Tell you why Bailey.

    I don’t drive and haven’t for close to 20 years – no drivers license.

    Don’t plan to travel and haven’t planned to since 9/11 – no passport.

    BC does not issue photo health cards.

    I have gov’t issued Quebec birth certificate – no picture and it’s in French only. My experience include not having gov’t issued birth certificate accepted as valid in Alberta and BC.

    Government demands for ‘high-security measures’ such as RDIF chips and requirements of photo ID are intrusive. I value my privacy and prefer to keep it that way. I also value my freedom. That freedom becomes less so with governments (and corporations) creating new ways to tack what I do, where I go etc… The less they stick their noses into my life (or yours or anyone’s) the better. (and I was way further off ‘the grid’ 20 years ago than I am now).

    What’s the next step? requirement that we all carry our ‘papers’ with us at all times? failure to do so resulting in what exactly?

    I don’t like the slope this is edging towards.

    I’ll turn the question back on you.

    What purpose does MORE identification really serve? And WHO does it serve?

    And I really wish someone could provide solid evidence of the ‘rationale’ behind all this C-31 claptrap in the first place. Where is the proof of ‘voter fraud’ and no, I don’t mean Cherniak’s ‘rumours’.

  • Further to what skdadl wrote..

    Interesting to note that the MPs from the North are the loudest in opposition to the new provisions of C-31. For good reason (and gee, what might those be….?)

    There’s also a pretty good chance that I, or someone like me, could potentially be disenfranchised in the federal dust-up (I prefer holding or carrying as little ID as possible. Don’t even get me started on RDIF chips and ‘smart’ ID). If C-31 passes I might be turned away at the polling station.

    Have to agree that it smells of voter suppression. No doubt there is some amount of ‘fraud’ perpetuated but if it’s as massive to be necessary to institute these measures where has our media been in reporting this widespread voter fraud.

    Oh wait, maybe that’s because there ISN’T ANY massive voter fraud.

  • Bailey

    Why do you fear that Bill C-31 will lead to voter suppression?

    What’s wrong with showing ID when you vote other than the voters card?

    Why would someone who is eligible to vote not have some sort of ID, a drivers license or a passport or even a photo health card?

  • Scott, you’re right that the fixation on “voter fraud” and some of the remedies that Bill C-31 prescribes are straight out of the Republican playbook. And some of the Republicans who’ve been playing that game look likely to be taking perp walks in the near future.

    I’m surprised enough that the Harper Cons haven’t noticed yet that they’re still following a master-script that is now being frantically shredded in Washington by the master scriptwriters, but it’s even stranger to hear that some Liberals yearn to play the same crooked games.

  • Whispering? More like shouting it from the rooftops.

  • audacious

    At this point, i’m glad he banished me off liblogs, the site he runs for liberal bloggers, he is an embarrassment to anyone who is liberal. Any yes, sadly, the likes of tarnishes many … .

  • The most ridiculous part of the rumour is that Chow beat her Liberal opponent by 3500 votes. For it to be true (and to have actually made a difference in the result), there would have had to be a highly organized posse of hundreds and hundreds of New Democrats hopping from poll to poll and voting again and again, and then somehow managing to keep it so quiet that the first rumblings of it come out in the blog of a Liberal who doesn’t even live in the riding, over a year later. I worked on an incredibly organized campaign last year, and trust me, there’s absolutely no way we could have done that even if we’d wanted to.

    Jason Cherniak’s slimeball rumourmongering doesn’t surprise me one whit, but somehow his complete lack of any sort of rational trains of thought always brings me up short.

  • JJ

    Happy Birthday, Scott!

  • Imraan

    I just can’t believe the Elfin King would throw out an unfounded rumour of huge electoral fraud with regards to Olivia Chow and the NDP, then, in the same post, ask to raise the tone and level of debate.

    If he has some proof, he must bring it forward – he’s not just some ordinary blogger, he’s the head of the Richmond Hill LPC riding association and the York Region Area Director as well.
    You simply can’t just throw out these huge criminal allegations without any background or support given.

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